A Conversation with Sam Nelson – HuffPost 10.14.11

Mike Ragogna: Sam Nelson of the group H Is Orange–how be you?

Sam Nelson: I’m good Mike, it’s nice to talk to you.

MR: Same here. It seems like only yesterday.

SN: Only yesterday.

MR: Anything happen since yesterday? Like, what’s going on with H Is Orange, leave out no detail, go.

SN: Lots is going on, actually. H Is Orange is a rock project that I’ve been with for close to 10 years, but we’ve been recording quite a bit. We just put out a new album, it’s an independent release, but we just got a song locked in with Guitar Hero. It’s been on heavy rotation and it’s been getting some good boosts. Hopefully, some touring possibly later, and intermittently, I’m dealing with a solo project, which is a lot more acoustic-based and organic. It’s not as full throttle as H Is Orange is. I’m back East right now, but I’m going to be headed back West to the rest of the guys and we’re talking about putting together a little tour. So, as soon as that happens, I will get the word out. Come check us out live!

MR: I guess this is that time when we catch everybody up on your relatives. We could start with that metal duo, Matthew and Gunner Nelson, from that group…what’s their name again?

SN: Nelson.

MR: Yes, that’s it. Also, there’s your actor sister, Tracy Nelson, who was kind enough to be my friend on Facebook. I feel like an honorary member of the family.

SN: Well, you are a part of the family, so that’s a given.

MR: (laughs) And there’s another famous duo you’re related to, Ozzie and Harriet Nelson, your iconic grandparents. Can you take us back with their story and how they became part of American pop culture?

SN: Absolutely. My grandparents started off in the start of radio when it was a mechanism to get information out there. Initially, my grandfather Ozzie started as a band leader; he actually had one of the biggest big bands in the country. He had a few number one hits, and during that period, he met my grandmother, Harriet. They then started a banter thing back and forth, so it became somewhat of a comedy show and, at the same time, a musical endeavor that you would go and experience. It was a full service show at the time and it became extremely popular throughout the country. This was when radio was pretty much your only ability to get aware of projects or new bands. They got picked up, and from there, they went into television.

They initially started a radio show that was to become The Adventures Of Ozzie & Harriet. Initially, it was a sitcom on radio where they would go back and forth, and it was a family-based sitcom; there wasn’t really much to change. They initially had two young actors playing their sons for the first four years on radio. They did several episodes and because of its popularity and because of the timing of things, it was a stroke of luck my grandfather had the ability to transition into this new, unbelievable, scary medium called “television,” that nobody had ever taken part in. They transitioned the show from radio to television and it became a huge hit. It was one of the only shows to watch on television, it was during a period of time when there were four channels on, and because of their national broadcast, the entire country got to watch their show.

From there, my father Rick and my Uncle David filled in for these child actors because on a whim, my grandfather brought in both of them to see how they could do in terms of reading lines and how the audience responded and they loved them. My father was the wise-cracking, punk kid. So, they soon transitioned my real dad and my real uncle into a show about my real family. It was kind of reality television before there was a reality television. My grandfather was incredibly prolific; he was a lawyer, but he wrote, directed, edited, performed all of the music, and did all of the queues by himself. Basically, it was a one man show that way. Obviously, he had help with writers that worked with him, but he was the guy. He was the guy that dealt with contracts and he dealt with the nuts and bolts of everything before anybody. He was the first to come up with incredible contracts to lock them in for extraordinary amounts of time on the air with the incredible sponsors that they had for the show. It was just a fantastic time.

MR: Was this the first show of its kind?

SN: It’s the first family situation comedy, yes. There was The Goldbergs, which was technically the first sitcom. But Ozzie and Harriet was the first most popularly received, I should say. Ozzie and Harriet was in there as one of the first.

MR: And after Ozzie & Harriet came shows like Father Knows Best and The Donna Reed Show.

SN: Exactly, and I Love Lucy followed-up. It was the torchbearer for all other situation comedies in the history of television.

MR: Of course, Ricky Nelson’s wisecracking and timing was a really major element of the success of the show, right?

SN: Absolutely. After a certain period of time, little punk kid Ricky started getting cuter and cuter to young ladies in the audience. My grandfather was an innovator and a genius, but the premise for a lot of the episodes is what happened in the family. As the story goes, he walked by my dad’s room one afternoon and heard a record playing. He asked, “What is that?” It was apparently at the time you could go down to Hollywood and Vine at the corner there and they would have a record store where you could walk in and sing a song and it would burn to vinyl and you could take it home. My dad sang, “I’m Walkin,'” with a bunch of friends one afternoon.

So then my grandfather walked by my dad’s room and said, “That’s amazing, I want to write a show about that,” and he did. I think at 17 years old, my dad sang “I’m Walkin'” on the air at the end of one of the episodes, and as smart as he was, my grandfather made sure there was a record in stores for the following Monday because that show aired on Sunday. “I’m Walkin'” sold a million copies in a week; he went from a punk little kid to one of the biggest musical stars in the world. From there, his own star just took off. From then on, my grandfather saw that as an opportunity and made sure my dad’s performances were very limited for the whole period of the show. He made sure he didn’t play extraneously or he didn’t do other shows ever. He only did the Ozzie and Harriet show, which forced the fans to watch the show. His performances at the end of the show would be the gem that people would wait for.

MR: That format paved the way for shows like The Monkees and The Partridge Family.

SN: Sure, absolutely. The thing that’s great on top of that was the length of the show, it lasted for 14 years in national syndication. It is still the longest running, live action sitcom on television. It’s absolutely due to people’s communion with the family, the fact that they loved the chance to grow up with them, which is really what they did. They grew up with my dad and my uncle being little boys to being older men. You have an entire generation that grew up with the family. In addition to that, there was my dad’s performances and breaking out and doing his own thing. It was this incredible experience for people to take an artist and grow with him. It was very new and very innovative, the concept was innovative and it worked.

MR: You’re now cleaning up and getting the old episodes ready for release with a bunch that are already done. What’s the cleanup process like…and you’re using the Kickstarter paradigm, right?

SN: That’s exactly right. To back up a little bit, I’m co-trustee of the Ozzie and Harriet trust. I was with my Uncle David who just passed away and after he passed, I was given access to family vaults, and was able to go in and look at the vast generations of Nelson family material. It spanned radio, film, and television–an unbelievable amount of material. In that, I found the original episodes for the entire seasons–435 episodes and the finest quality, never before seen footage, behind the scenes footage, and interviews, all of that stuff that was just sitting there for years. Digging deeper, I noticed the materials were starting to deteriorate, so I tried to put my head together and figure out a way to start restoring and reviving. I did some research and talked to some friends, and they recommended a website called Kickstarter. Kickstarter is basically defined as the number one indie funding platform in the world for independent projects mainly based in arts and entertainment. Usually, they will take a new artist and newer project and try to acquire funding for it. There’s a period, if you have a number in mind and you can get to that number or surpass it, you get to keep it at the end of the period. If you don’t, you don’t get anything, it’s an all or nothing funding process…it’s pretty incredible. (Note: Ozzie & Harriet Kickstarter Page)

I was concerned about how the project would be received, so I tried to be creative and create a project that took Kickstarter even further and instead of taking something new, I could take this asset that is a legacy asset and put it through Kickstarter and breathe new life into it and approach it from a new place to help in the process of revitalizing these episodes. The thing that was really important to me was that I really wanted people to participate with us in this process, and that’s exactly how Kickstarter is based. People come in and they participate with you to help fund your project; in exchange for funding, you offer awards. They could be anything. Our rewards are little more creative because of these elements that we found in storage. For example, we have drawings and sketches that my grandfather Ozzie did when he was in college, so one of these awards are one of his drawings. So, it gives an intimate personal feel and it’s something nobody has seen. It’s not out there for the mass market. Of course, we have Ozzie & Harriet T-shirts which are cool and have never been done before–there has never been any merchandise for Ozzie & Harriet, so there’s that avenue.

The biggest thing is you can actually sponsor an episode, and there are 435 episodes total–14 years of national syndication–and you can basically take your favorite episode and be its sponsor. Along with credit as the official sponsor, you go down in history as the person who did it and made it happen. So, Kickstarter, I see as this unbelievable tool. This is a time we live in that has been an incredible perfect opportunity. It does exactly what I want it to do, in terms of helping the process of getting the shows out there again. The goal is, from there, to broadcast, and that’s another revitalization. I’m also doing a documentary on the side about doing the revitalizations. I’ve interviewed people involved with the show, plus editors, writers, and actors who were closely involved and are still around and have that document footage. I want to get “the people side,” the fans who grew up with the show. The Kickstarter project has been launched and I’m already getting these stories from people that grew up with my family. I want to document those and put that footage together about the revitalization of the show. So, it’s kind of like a two-fold process.

MR: Didn’t you do something similar for funding an H Is Orange project?

SN: Actually, way back when, there was no such thing as Kickstarter, but during our first tour, we were in need, so I actually put something together called “The eBay Song.” This was in the beginning days of eBay, and we offered our fans the opportunity that we would write a song for you if you helped fund our tour, which was the gist of it, and we got funding for our tour. The idea was that there were two fans that came in and helped us and we just got a checklist of who they were as people, and the band got together and wrote it for them, and it’s actually up on YouTube right now. It’s called, “Where You Belong.” It’s the premise of people participating in their own experience. Nowadays, instead of having that “this side, that side” wall between entertainment and art, I love the idea that people can be a part of your experience. Really, that’s what Kickstarter does and encourages, and it’s a perfect place for the Ozzie & Harriet reviving project to be launched from.

MR: What’s the goal?

SN: It’s tricky. Our preliminary goal is ten thousand dollars, that will help get our foot in the door to get our process going. 435 episodes is an unbelievable amount of material to go through…the real ultimate goal would be about fifty to sixty-thousand dollars. The ten thousand dollar mark will put us in a fantastic place to help snowball the rest of the donors.

I really want to be the first here with you with this interview to state this is an incredible tool. I really encourage anybody with a project that historically speaking is important and needs to be recognized, I would use this as the tool. When Kickstarter is over, when the term is over, the official Ozzie and Harriet site will go up. There’s a preliminary page right now; it needs a little tweaking, but that will also have a follow up that will be Kickstarter-like, where you can continue to donate. When the first batch is done, we can go back in and say, “Here’s the listing of the episodes, come on in and sponsor one.” In addition to the Kickstarter project, we have something really fantastic happening–a potential Ozzie & Harriet induction to the Smithsonian museum. I’m trying to tie this into the Smithsonian–be it a first batch, or be it all 435 episodes–to be released at the induction of the ceremony for the Smithsonian.

MR: Now, UCLA has come into the mix in the past when old movies, recordings, etc., have needed restoration and storage. Have they been involved with this project at all?

SN: Yes, they’re amazing. They aren’t necessarily involved particularly in the restoration because of the amount of materials, but with regard to housing and preserving, they have been seminal and incredible. We’re also dealing with The Library Of Congress in Washington D.C. to deal with the other portion of the materials. The issue too is that my grandfather was incredibly meticulous, and at the time, had multiple copies of the episodes. So, he would have three different copies of 35 millimeter fine grains just to have them. He would have three copies of 16 millimeter of the same episode, and he would have formats that don’t even exist anymore like 35-32s. It was daunting to go into storage and figure out where to even start with it. Everybody has been incredibly helpful–UCLA, The Library Of Congress, and other resources in terms of housing and preserving and cleaning up. It’s definitely been a full team effort. This Kickstarter thing is great because you can give the rest of the team–which is the people, the fans and the friends who love the show and haven’t been able to help in any way–give them the opportunity to dive in and be a part of the process.

MR: Now, with all of these being cleaned up, and because it’s been out of circulation for so long, can Ozzie & Harriet be reintroduced to places like TV Land or even PBS stations because of the historic nature of that show?

SN: Absolutely. To have this as a family asset is incredible. From a branding/marketing point of view, most companies spend their lives taking something that they built from nothing and try to have people recognize the name. With Ozzie & Harriet, you can go up to anybody in the street and ask, “Hey, do you know Ozzie & Harriet,” and they go, “Yeah, I’ve heard of it.” You ask, “Do you know what it is,” and they have no idea, and you look at that and think that’s incredible because it has such a weight to it. It’s such a part of the American lexicon, it’s such a part of Americana. It deserves the building of that foundation, and that’s what my goal is…to build that foundation. People are aware of Ozzie & Harriet, and now it’s about why it’s important and let them be a part of that process.

MR: The show not only has cred based on its historical importance, but also from its introducing music through your dad who was America’s first teen idol, right?

SN: I think the term was actually coined for him in Life Magazine. The music carried the show; when people talk about Ozzie & Harriet, my dad was kind of a satellite within the show. He was definitely the thing that people were drawn to and the music was something that people were drawn to. But, you know, my grandfather Ozzie was a hit maker himself in his own day. He recognized how important, structurally, music was to the premise. I think he, in many ways, deserves as much credit as my dad does. My dad was an incredible talent all to himself, but my grandfather Ozzie recognized that.

MR: Where I was going with that was it also was a show launched your dad as well as young sounds of the era such as rockabilly.

SN: Absolutely. It’s funny, there was Elvis and there was my dad. Then there was a slew of teen idols fabricated after the fact. Elvis was the renegade, he went up there and he scared parents. I think there was a biography done on my family, and it was addressed that my dad was accepted by everybody because of the show. Parents enjoyed and appreciated it, and said it was a wholesome enough show that they didn’t really see the danger in it. Then, like a Trojan horse, my dad came in with rockabilly, this California sound, and then brought rock ‘n’ roll into mainstream America. He smuggled it in through their televisions, unbeknownst to everybody rocking out to Ricky Nelson. But it was okay because it was a part of the Nelson persona. The reality was that, absolutely, he was rocking it.

MR: Years ago, you worked on a release of Ricky Nelson material with musical segments from the show compiled onto a DVD. How did that come together?

SN: That came through Capitol Records. I was there working at the time and our representation handled Frank Sinatra. There was a production company which had handled many music related projects. Should I name names?

MR: Yeah, go for it.

SN: John Scheinfeld came in with his company, and he was a super-fan of my dad, thought it was a great idea, and it had never been done before officially especially through the family. We compiled as many performances from the Ozzie & Harriet shows as we could, and we put them out there. It did extremely well, and I think everybody–including the record company–was stunned by how well it actually did.

MR: It was the only release that made the link of your dad, Ozzie & Harriet, and those great songs.

SN: It wasn’t just a presentation of the performances. There was definitely a narrative all of the way through about the show, first and foremost, but also why my dad resonated and how he resonated and how he took off. There was a brief biography and then the performances followed.

MR: You also performed a tribute to your dad with your brothers on that DVD.

SN: That was a fluke, actually. I had never performed ever with my brothers. We were just hanging out in the studio; James Burton the legendary guitarist was there–he played with Elvis and my dad. He was rocking out with my brothers, they had just done a couple of songs, I was literally just standing in the corner and my brothers said they wanted to play “Garden Party,” which is one of my dad’s seminal swan songs acoustically. I got a nudge in my back and I didn’t know who it was specifically, but I started walking towards the microphone. They stood there and kind of looked at me and they said, “All right, let’s do it.” That was a one-take wonder and we just did it; it was pretty amazing. The whole room lit up and everybody’s eyes were wide open and looking at each other, and we thought, “Wow, this is kind of magical.” My brothers and I finished, and we’re brothers, so we have brotherly relationships. It’s good, but creatively speaking, we go in our own directions. I think that was the first time we realized that there was some sort of unifying line that went through all of us, and we got really excited about it. It was a really cool experience and I’m glad it was captured on film.

MR: We need to talk about your dad for a second. There must be one story that reflects your relationship with your dad.

SN: Wow, he passed away when I was pretty young. He passed away when I was 12, and I got a chance to see him usually around Christmas time. That’s when he wasn’t touring, and my parents were going through a little bit of a brutal divorce at that point, so to see him was few and far between. I was living with my grandparents at the time, the Harmons. We would coordinate, and he would come over, and we’d go out shopping and basically he wanted to be the good dad when he could see me. There wasn’t anything in particular…I could say that we played tennis quite a bit. He was nationally ranked, which few people know. He was a remarkable tennis player. Every time I saw him, he would sneak us to the tennis courts, and I would be this little kid with a bandanna on and we would play tennis–Rick Nelson and his little kid. People would swarm around the cages to see what was going on, obviously, when he was recognized. He didn’t care, he did what he needed to do to be a good dad. He signed every autograph that came his way, but for the most part, when he was with me, it was about being a father, which is a big memory at this point, since it’s been so long. It really stood out for me as being very important, and I will carry with me forever.

MR: He was also very supportive of your music, wasn’t he?

SN: Well, at that point I was only twelve. For the most part, I wasn’t writing or making music, but I was singing all the time. He followed me around to hear me sing. With regards to recording, he had a recorder on him all the time and about five Christmases ago, my brothers handed me a micro-cassette and said, “This is for you.” So, I went and got it transferred, and the title of this thing was “Sam Is Born.” It was basically my birth. He had this recorder with him when he walked into our house at the time, and my sister and brothers were there, and he just talked to them about me and about my being born. It’s about a twenty-minute thing, and my brothers and sisters go into it, being older siblings now, of a little brother. That’s the whole experience on tape, and it’s phenomenal. It brings out who he was as a human being, not just a legend or a rock star or a performer, and it’s mine. I’m grateful.

MR: While you were growing up and after your dad passed away, you were sort of left to fill in the blanks. You had memorabilia, stories, the television shows, and his records. This isn’t meant to be an offensive question, you know that, but just how entrenched in his world did you become after your father’s passing?

SN: Extremely. I think for many factors. First of all, as a twelve-year-old boy who loses a father, that’s just a tremendous experience anyway. For a twelve-year-old boy who, literally, the whole country was mourning the death of his father, was profoundly…I don’t even know what the word would be. It was an amazing time. At that point, the media wasn’t at the same place it is today, so you got what you saw on the news and everybody listened to the news. There was no internet and it wasn’t a flash in the pan. So, when he passed away, literally, the whole world mourned. It was hard for me because I spent much of my time…like I said, my parents were going through a divorce, seeing him very intermittently. But when we saw each other, we were very close. I knew he took special time with me. We bonded that way–playing tennis, swimming together. He took time out for me. I know this might sound cheesy, but I feel like I knew who he was. There was no real explanation to that. When he died, there was a lot of catching up to do, and I was confused like anyone would be. I didn’t get it or understand it. Then, it started to slowly sink in that oh my God, this is forever. Then I started turning to the music.

Over the course of my whole life, I really dove into his music as a safe haven. It’s like a cushion, it’s something I can go in and understand who he was as a person through his music. I’m beyond grateful for that opportunity because who else has that kind of opportunity to evolve with him as an artist…and he helped me evolve as a person. Going from the teenage idol years to being who he was, to try to emulate somebody else or sound like somebody else, and then working to musically find out who he was on his own, is everybody’s life struggle. He did it musically and I got to experience that with him through his music, and I’m forever in debt to him. Further that with regard to the shows, they’re 435 episodes, 435 home movies, basically. Going even further back, I was very close with my grandmother, Harriet. I used to go down and visit with her, and it was exactly that; if she had a story, it was on film. There was no doubt about it because that’s how Ozzie wrote. “That’s really funny, let’s put it in an episode.” So, she would tell me about something and there it would be. I got to know my dad through that as well. If I had questions for her, because it was the early ’90s when she passed away and my dad passed away in ’85, I could go down there and get intimate details and she would not only tell me, but she would show me. I’m forever grateful that I’ve had this opportunity, but it’s been amazing and I am who I am because of it.

MR: It was almost with all of these materials that you had access to, you had more access to your father than many kids do with their fathers while growing up.

SN: It’s absolutely true. First and foremost, it doesn’t matter who you are but if you knew my dad–and I’m not just saying this because I’m his son–he was the nicest human being on the planet.

MR: Not to change gears so suddenly, but why aren’t you on your brothers’ hit “Love And Affection.”

SN: (laughs) I’m not on it?

MR: (laughs) Again I ask you, sir. Why wasn’t Sam Nelson a part of Nelson?

SN: Well, I’m seven years younger than my brothers, they were 21, so I was 14 or 15 years old. I was still in school and they had been playing music their whole lives, and I had grown up with them with my mom. They did their thing musically, and being exceptional musicians, I was in awe of them. And I was definitely doing my own thing musically. Like I said about the “Garden Party” performance, we had never crossed those paths. I can tell you for sure, I was A&R-ing their stuff much earlier than that. Their recordings are truly incredible and I have some of the stuff that they did when they were much younger in there teens. I actually have a really cool recording and a really cool story–this is probably something they should tell. Well, I think they were about eleven years old, and they were in a band playing together. As eleven-year-olds would, one of my brothers is playing bass and the other brother is playing drums. One day, it was their birthday, and my mother said, “You’ve guys got to go to the dentist today, it’s the only day he’s got open, you’ve got to go.”

So, they went to this office and they walked in, and it wasn’t the dentist’s office, in fact it was a recording studio. My father was sitting there and The Pointer Sisters were sitting there, and they recorded one of my brother’s songs at eleven years old with The Pointer Sisters singing background. I have that on tape still, and it is a phenomenal song. It is a straight through a little pop song, and it was extraordinary. You listen to that and to have that kind of musical talent around growing up was a little daunting and a little scary. My brothers appreciated me enough to let me have input. I remember it was two years before “Love And Affection” was released and they had a really crappy tape recording of it and I turned to my brother Matt and said, “This is a hit song.” He said, “Really, you like it?” I said, “This is extraordinary.” Two years later, it became #1 in the world, so it was kind of cool to be a part of that process. So, if anything, if I’ve had any input, it’s been on the periphery. And that might change. This “Garden Party” experience that we had with the Ricky Nelson Sings DVD opened many eyes in good ways. As we all mature, maybe we can start moving musically in that direction and we might have something to offer later on.

MR: In addition to your H Is Orange project, you’re working on a new solo album.

SN: Since I’ve been out I’ve been away from the West Coast and I’ve been writing like crazy, I have about 43 songs, if you can believe it. I’ve been recording basic demos here that I’m going to hopefully be taking back to LA. It’s a little bit more country-rock, a little more acoustic singer-songwriter based. It’s kind of a new approach for me. H Is Orange is more balls to the wall and this is a completely different energy and something I’ve been wanting to do for a long time, so I’m excited about that as well.

MR: What’s Tracy up to these days?

SN: Tracy is doing great. She’s a full time mom in Los Angeles, she’s got two beautiful kids and she’s doing a great job with them.

MR: Nice, we’ve gone through your whole back story, gee, am I forgetting anyone? Let’s see…

SN: The Harmons.

MR: Why, Mark Harmon is your uncle, isn’t he.

SN: Who? (laughs)

MR: You may not know this, but Gibbs is your uncle.

SN: Is he…really? Wow. (laughs)

MR: Yes Sam, and you’ve got a Mark Harmon story don’t you. Cough it up.

SN: Mark is great. For the most part, Mark has been my father figure. He’s been there for me through my whole life, he’s been my rock to lean on and an incredible person. I lived with him right after my dad died, actually. Again, there was the divorce and an issue with custody and what not. I actually petitioned to move in with him and live with him. That experience really changed me. It was only about four months, but it really motivated me to want to be better. From that experience with him, he defined that idea of you’ve got to work hard and you’ve got to do what you’ve got to do and be the best person you can be. That’s what I’ve tried to carry on.

MR: So, when are you going to be on NCIS? Mark, are you reading this?

SN: Technically I already am. In fact, it’s kind of cool. Once in a while, he pulls a surprise out of his hat, like when a couple of H Is Orange songs ended up on NCIS these past couple of years. Abby, who’s the computer tech punk chick on the show? There was a tape on the counter and she lifted it up and said, “Oh cool you listen to H Is Orange.” That was pretty cool.

MR: I love that Abby.

SN: So, we’ve already been on technically.

MR: Sam, what is your advice for new artists?

SN: You know, it’s such a new world all the time. My advice is do what you do and keep doing it. It might sound as cliché as possible, but do what you do and don’t chase it. The second you start chasing it, it’s over. The best that you can be is when you’re out in front of it and people resonate to you, not when you’re following other trends or a goal that somebody else puts out for you. Be the best that you can be. Not to sound cheesy, but you can’t please everyone, you have to please yourself. The older that I’m getting, I realize that in every aspect–not just art and music–it’s really about cherishing who you are and offering what you do best and continuing to do it.

MR: We talked about just about everything we can talk about. You’ve got anything else?

SN: Well, how are you doing Mike?

MR: I’m doing okay, the Midwest is berry, berry good. So, aren’t you amazed at how much slower I’ve been talking?

SN: No, you’re actually much faster now. (laughs)

MR: It’s something in the water. (laughs) Sam, it was great catching up with you.

SN: Well, thank you so much, sir.

MR: You’ve got it. Please take care of yourself and come back soon.

SN: Absolutely, and thank you everybody for your support and consideration.